New changes in the FISTF Board

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New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Admin on Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:38 am

From: FISTF Sports Department

To: National Associations Chairmen / Competition Managers / Clubs / Players

Ref. 27-11/12 November 28h, 2011

Subject: FISTF Board of Directors - Replacements

Dear Sirs/Madams,

On its meeting of November 23rd, 2011, the FISTF Board took the following decisions:

1 - New FISTF Sports Director

Mr. Antonello Rodriquez, from Italy, is the new FISTF Sports Director ad interim until next Congress, where he will be officially confirmed.

He was nominated by the FISTF President under the FISTF Statutes, article 12, replacing Mr. Stefano De Francesco, that present his resignation.

His tasks are fully described in the Statutes, article 17, and they will be assumed with all rights and obligations that an elected member has in the FISTF Board of Directors.

2 - New FISTF General Secretary

Mr. Luís Filipe Horta, from Portugal, is the new FISTF General Secretary ad interim until next Congress, where he will be officially confirmed, leaving his role as FISTF Communication Director.

He was nominated by the FISTF President under the FISTF Statutes, article 12.

His tasks are fully described in the Statutes, article 20, and they will be assumed with all rights and obligations that an elected member has in the FISTF Board of Directors.

3 - New FISTF Communication Director

A new Communication Director will be appointed soon.

Best Regards

FISTF Board of Directors
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  maxischn on Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:39 am

vincent, your turn for comm.director once more! Very Happy
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Admin on Mon Nov 28, 2011 2:13 pm

You so funny...

WASPA communication director? Is it what you mean? Very Happy
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  von K. on Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:23 am

Which President nominated these directors? The one who is not President according to statutes, or Vulpes?

No problem with the names, but I'd rather see a vote of condfidence, or something. And there is still Koutrou hanging around...

It makes me think, though, that when I asked before Madrid from De Francesco why there can't be another italian as a candidate, the answer was (laughing): What would be the point? I would still say to him what to do!

Has that changed, perhaps? I hope so...

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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Heinz Eder on Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:35 am

Vesa, are you sure that Fred has to be the president?
I think that decision should be done by the FISTF Board, because in that case the statutes are not clear too and there are 2 possibilities as we all know.
I think it is a thing of interpretation, but we are moving around for the last 2 years, I say it one more time that hopefully somebody noticed all those points which have to be corrected in the actual statutes, if nobody is ready to write totally new statutes, which changes the whole organization of FISTF.
On the new homepage of FISTF you can read it "20th anniversity 2012" that would be a nice reason to give us a new out-look. We saw that it is needed in the last 2 years.

von K. wrote:Which President nominated these directors? The one who is not President according to statutes, or Vulpes?

No problem with the names, but I'd rather see a vote of condfidence, or something. And there is still Koutrou hanging around...

It makes me think, though, that when I asked before Madrid from De Francesco why there can't be another italian as a candidate, the answer was (laughing): What would be the point? I would still say to him what to do!

Has that changed, perhaps? I hope so...

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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  maxischn on Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:56 am

hey guys, who else will send in application for all positions? (where does it say you are not allowed to? Very Happy) - gonna be funny elections with 20 rounds to vote for a president unless only 2 candidates are left Very Happy
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  zinga on Tue Nov 29, 2011 1:53 pm

Heinz or maxischn,

This may sound like child's request from the elementary school level, but...

Could you correct in SN.forum that Finland is not against the attempt of Garnier. We have no opinion, at least yet, as a member nation. We however would like that the rules and statutes are followed.

I am banned, as you may know...
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Thossa on Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:41 pm

zinga wrote:Heinz or maxischn,

This may sound like child's request from the elementary school level, but...

Could you correct in SN.forum that Finland is not against the attempt of Garnier. We have no opinion, at least yet, as a member nation. We however would like that the rules and statutes are followed.

I am banned, as you may know...

Just leave him alone with his own point of view Wink
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Janus_Gersie on Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:51 pm

zinga wrote:Heinz or maxischn,

This may sound like child's request from the elementary school level, but...

Could you correct in SN.forum that Finland is not against the attempt of Garnier. We have no opinion, at least yet, as a member nation. We however would like that the rules and statutes are followed.

I am banned, as you may know...



I sent him an email with my comments about his comment (because "Germany" was also mentioned). I am also no user of the SN forum.

On the other side: who cares about the SN forum ? It is just history ....
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  maxischn on Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:02 pm

he does read your / ours comments here as well, so nevermind then, and as almost every country in the world agrees with garnier as a president, everything is fine! Very Happy
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Admin on Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:19 pm

Garnier as president is like having no president.

In Belgium we have no government but things are going well.

So let's keep FISTF without president if things run smoothly anyway Very Happy

Seriously speaking, Garnier as president is no the most important thing. But what is his program as president? Because apart from saying "we need to speak" and "stop the fights", I don't see what are his plans for FISTF/table football...
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  von K. on Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:59 pm

Heinz, I'm sure. As Marcus pointed ou, the statutes say president ad interim is the vice president with most years in the BoD. General secretary is not vice president, and Fred has most years of the others remaining (I checked, and it doesn't say most years continuously, which would mean Koutrou). The statutes are clearly written in this matter. If the statutes are thought wrong here, is another matter.

I agree that the statutes have to be "repaired". It was supposed to be prioritised by the new BoD after all that has happened the last 2 years, but even when our president (Zinga) asked about this and volunteered for a commission doing it, nothing happened.

This is why we live with these statutes now.

(They are also the same statutes Garnier used to make circus of the Madrid elections. But let's not go into that once more...)

Heinz Eder wrote:Vesa, are you sure that Fred has to be the president?
I think that decision should be done by the FISTF Board, because in that case the statutes are not clear too and there are 2 possibilities as we all know.
I think it is a thing of interpretation, but we are moving around for the last 2 years, I say it one more time that hopefully somebody noticed all those points which have to be corrected in the actual statutes, if nobody is ready to write totally new statutes, which changes the whole organization of FISTF.
On the new homepage of FISTF you can read it "20th anniversity 2012" that would be a nice reason to give us a new out-look. We saw that it is needed in the last 2 years.

von K. wrote:Which President nominated these directors? The one who is not President according to statutes, or Vulpes?

No problem with the names, but I'd rather see a vote of condfidence, or something. And there is still Koutrou hanging around...

It makes me think, though, that when I asked before Madrid from De Francesco why there can't be another italian as a candidate, the answer was (laughing): What would be the point? I would still say to him what to do!

Has that changed, perhaps? I hope so...

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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  von K. on Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:06 pm

Garnier is not the most important point, of course.

The thing that really depresses me (not really, it's more like black humour) is that the statutes are completely ignored by so many countries. I would say the same thing if I would be in Garnier's place. Because, as some know, I also challenged myself from the decision of finnish vote for president in Madrid. I was a candidate, so I let the other finnish Board members decide. This is how it should be. Go by the book, the rules etc.

Garnier as a general secretary can not be the president of FISTF. If the vice presidents all decline, it is elections that decide. But GS is not mentioned in the statutes as a possible president. Full stop.

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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  kechris on Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:26 pm

Ι had a very good opinion for Fred Vulpes.
I cann't understand why he didn't ask to be president.
I cann't understand why he left Garnier as president.
I cann't understand why he didn't retire if they didn't follow the rules for president.
I cann't understand why Luis change position?
Why change position without find a new communication?
Who selected Antonello for sport director?
Fred is a German and the same time his country ask EGM.
I AM CONFUSED.

WHEN YOU WILL STOP FUCKING TABLE SOCCER FOR YOUR LOVE FOR CHAIRS?
Where is the presidents of federations?
WAKE UP.
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Janus_Gersie on Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:47 pm

kechris wrote:Ι had a very good opinion for Fred Vulpes.
I cann't understand why he didn't ask to be president.
I cann't understand why he left Garnier as president.
I cann't understand why he didn't retire if they didn't follow the rules for president.
I cann't understand why Luis change position?
Why change position without find a new communication?
Who selected Antonello for sport director?
Fred is a German and the same time his country ask EGM.
I AM CONFUSED.

WHEN YOU WILL STOP FUCKING TABLE SOCCER FOR YOUR LOVE FOR CHAIRS?
Where is the presidents of federations?
WAKE UP.

You can still keep your good opinion about Fred ! Fred is a hard worker but no leader. Therefore he never wanted to be president. And he didn't resign because he still want to support FISTF. What would have happened if he would have left the board ? Only more confusion and chaos ....
So please keep your support for Fred. He is not looking for the chair but for the work to be done.

And please read my comments properly: Germany didn't ask for an EGM. We want the board to call for new elections in order to strengthen the board. Currently almost the whole board is "ad interim". To give the board more handling confidence it makes sense to elect now. And Fred doesn't have to be scared because he is doing his job and he would be elected again if elections would take place.

As for Luis and Antonello I can't give you answers .....
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Heinz Eder on Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:47 pm

Hi Kostas,
in case of Fred i only can guess that the reason is that he isn't that kind of guy, who asks for himself the first row. Fred is a very trustful, responsible and credible man.
As far as I know Fred from several years of working together he is not interested in getting in conflict with anybody.
About the rest of the BoD I can't say much, because I don't know them to say something about their reasons.
Personally I don't see anything strange in it that the german association asks for new elections while Fred is bod member of FISTF.

Most presidents of the associations think positive about Laurent, so they easily don't seem to care about the FISTF statutes anymore.

Only my thoughts about your points, but maybe somebody could ask Fred to answer Kostas questions.

Heinz

kechris wrote:Ι had a very good opinion for Fred Vulpes.
I cann't understand why he didn't ask to be president.
I cann't understand why he left Garnier as president.
I cann't understand why he didn't retire if they didn't follow the rules for president.
I cann't understand why Luis change position?
Why change position without find a new communication?
Who selected Antonello for sport director?
Fred is a German and the same time his country ask EGM.
I AM CONFUSED.

WHEN YOU WILL STOP FUCKING TABLE SOCCER FOR YOUR LOVE FOR CHAIRS?
Where is the presidents of federations?
WAKE UP.

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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Admin on Tue Nov 29, 2011 6:07 pm

The not so funny thing about Garnier is to read comments like "Garnier is great because he was doing great things in the early 90s" but everybody forgets he was the one who let FISTF down in 1996 with no money left in the bank (!) and the kind of "ghost" who did absolutely nothing from 1996 till now (even in the french Board he's doing almost everything wrong).

Common sense? Where?
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  von K. on Tue Nov 29, 2011 6:18 pm

Heinz Eder wrote:
Personally I don't see anything strange in it that the german association asks for new elections while Fred is bod member of FISTF.

I agree. Once a person is in the FISTF BoD he is not working for his country. Unfortunately this has been forgotten by many. Even the candidates should let others decide if he will be voted by his country.

Fred, as far as I know (he visited Helsinki and is just the nicest guy you can find), is just like described here. He wants to help FISTF and is not interested in the politics. Luìs seems, in my limited opinion, to be the same kind. He wants to help FISTF. Antonello is a mystery for me, but I have an open mind for him. The only problem was his involvement in SN administration (but that could be cleared by the person who organised it all). I do know, as an example for devotion, that he did massive promotion (his holidays) for the World Cup in Rome, only to find out later that it was moved to Palermo.

Heinz Eder wrote:Most presidents of the associations think positive about Laurent, so they easily don't seem to care about the FISTF statutes anymore.

This is a huge problem! Not Garnier, but the statutes part. I don't know if most like him, maybe they do. However it is irrelevant. All these associations openly go against FISTF statutes, which could, to my knowledge, even lead to the dismantilng of FISTF. A federation that does not follow its rules can be dismantled by the authorities. I'm not sure, as I'm not a lawyer, but I know it's been talked about in some cases.

The other problem is that with this disregard to the statutes FISTF has nothing to stand on. Anyone willing to do anything he wants, can do it, and then go to courts and show clearly that FISTF statutes are not followed, so why should he (or it when talking of associations). FISTF also loses possibility to give sanctions etc.

So, please, people! Let's have Fred (or the next, Koutrou, if Fred doesn't want to) as president and he calls for new elections. The only other choice is EGM. Otherwise members are not acting according to their responsibility.

If we have elections in either of these ways, I don't honestly give a rats ass if Garnier is elected as president. If most presidents (and more importantly, most Boards) like him, then he will be elected. And then we can elect Luìs as GS, Antonello as SD, Fre for finances, Koutrou for nothing, and life is peachy again.

What on earth is the problem with this? Shocked

Underlined: I have nothing against Garnier being president, if he is elected according to the statutes in transparent and proper elections.

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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Admin on Tue Nov 29, 2011 7:06 pm

Vesa, you are probably 100% right but I have the feeling there are not more than 10 people on earth who really care about FISTF & statutes,... At the end I just wonder if we are mental to discuss all this as the big majority of players doesn't care!
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  von K. on Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:04 am

Heinz, you wrote an extremely good post in the SN. My sentiments, almost exactly. I'm just a bit more flammable than you. Thanks a lot, it was pleasure to read it!

Admin wrote:Vesa, you are probably 100% right but I have the feeling there are not more than 10 people on earth who really care about FISTF & statutes,... At the end I just wonder if we are mental to discuss all this as the big majority of players doesn't care!

In that case FISTF is dead. No obliging statutes, no federation.

Sad, because people waste time thinking about this Potemkin Federation.





p.s. Could someone (the finns are banned) correct in the SN that Finland is not against Garniers attempt (what it is, in concrete, I don't really know, but we have always underlined collaboration). We have no official BoD decision to announce regarding the happenings after Capponi and De Francesco ran away.

p.s.2 Stefano's post also indicates that Vincent is an association Cool Maybe he meant Belgium, which asked for elections already.

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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  kechris on Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:49 am

Janus_Gersie wrote:

You can still keep your good opinion about Fred ! Fred is a hard worker but no leader. Therefore he never wanted to be president. And he didn't resign because he still want to support FISTF. What would have happened if he would have left the board ? Only more confusion and chaos ....
So please keep your support for Fred. He is not looking for the chair but for the work to be done.

Come on Janus. Does Fred want support this FISTF BoD? How he can work in this BoD? he is member of a team which called BoD of FISTF. Three of them (50%) resigned. President sport director and communication director. I will keep my goood opinion for Fred but in this occasion he did a TERRIBLE mistake. He can accept to be president and immediately to ask EGM and elections. Now if this fake BoD fail, Fred is the certain responsible.The other two elected (no selected) members are absent

And please read my comments properly: Germany didn't ask for an EGM. We want the board to call for new elections in order to strengthen the board. Currently almost the whole board is "ad interim". To give the board more handling confidence it makes sense to elect now. And Fred doesn't have to be scared because he is doing his job and he would be elected again if elections would take place.

I didn't like this comment. Maybe i didn't understand well but i think that you wrote that Fred first care is to relected again. I think that the first care for all is to save table soccer. If even Fred care for his job then we spend our time and our words in this forum...
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Heinz Eder on Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:45 am

Maybe Fred shows his love for tablesoccer by working for the good of the community. Working for the good of the community means that he is doing a job on the FISTF Board. If he wouldn't work things in financial department of FISTF maybe wouldn't work well anymore, which would be negative for FISTF. He is not working for Laurent or Piero before, he is working for FISTF and tablesoccer. I know your view is different, in your view he works for a board, personally I see it different. Out of my view I totally understand Fred. Even if you don't understand that view, there is no reason to bring Fred in misscredit.

Please don't forget that nobody is paid for working regulary for tablesoccer. I know you would destroy things before you would accept it to work for something important with people together who you maybe don't really like. Fred is the opposite, he doesn't want to destroy at any price.

An association needs a board that's a fact, if everybody, who is on the board only loves a chair, then maybe nobody should sit on any chair and we meet each other only to play friendly game without any result.
No world ranking, no world cup, no official tournaments, not the same rules, nothing. Then nobody would have to sit on a chair, which seems automatically to be something to execrete in your view.

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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Janus_Gersie on Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:40 pm

kechris wrote:Come on Janus. Does Fred want support this FISTF BoD? How he can work in this BoD? he is member of a team which called BoD of FISTF. Three of them (50%) resigned. President sport director and communication director. I will keep my goood opinion for Fred but in this occasion he did a TERRIBLE mistake. He can accept to be president and immediately to ask EGM and elections. Now if this fake BoD fail, Fred is the certain responsible.The other two elected (no selected) members are absent

Why did he make a mistake ? He only wants to support FISTF in his best way. That's all ... As I already mentioned he is not looking for being president. He is happy with his role in the board. He is not a guy playing political games. If he would have been asked to be president he would have resigned immediately. Maybe you don't know Fred very well. He is doing the work and don't want to be in the first row.



kechris wrote:I didn't like this comment. Maybe i didn't understand well but i think that you wrote that Fred first care is to relected again. I think that the first care for all is to save table soccer. If even Fred care for his job then we spend our time and our words in this forum...

No, no, you misunderstood me. Fred is first of all looking on how to support FISTF. He is the one who is really taking care of tablefootball. His first aim is to do his job .... and I don't tell you about his personal opinion if he would like to have new elections or not. This you have to do by yourself.

Regarding Fred forget everything about political games or bad behaviour or .... He is one of the most honest men I know.
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  kechris on Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:07 pm

Ι know well Fred. I met him many times the last years and i respect him. But i don't undertand how he help fistf if support sick situations.
I show FISTF statutes in a lawyer who works for french companies.
He said that the persons who are in BoD WITHOUT ELECTIONS ARE ILLEGAL.
When a member resign then the person who was candidate for the SAME position must replace him. No other person who is not candidate.
And if the 50% of ELECTED MEMBERS resign then elections must take place. No BoD with one elected member and 5 selected. This is not democracy.
We have a BoD with three members. Sorry but elections is not political game. Political games are the selected members who change positions. And if we don't make elections in close time then will destroy and the next year.
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Re: New changes in the FISTF Board

Post  Marcus Tilgner on Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:35 pm

kechris wrote:
And if the 50% of ELECTED MEMBERS resign then elections must take place. No BoD with one elected member and 5 selected. This is not democracy.
We have a BoD with three members. Sorry but elections is not political game. Political games are the selected members who change positions. And if we don't make elections in close time then will destroy and the next year.

Thumbs up...!

Knowing Fred I can say that he's just afraid that EVERYTHING may be lost when the WORK is not done. Me personally I would act differently but I know that he acts in a good intention! And this should NEVER be questioned when we speak about him.
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