New plastic goalkeeper

Page 1 of 3 1, 2, 3  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Thossa on Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:14 pm

10 - 12 € for the plastic keeper seems to me too much money affraid
Will it be multicolored?
avatar
Thossa
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 627
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 55
Location : Far beyond

View user profile http://www.dstfb.de

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Guest on Thu Apr 22, 2010 2:07 pm

Thossa

you live in the homeland of the playmobil!! Playmobil ..... are the best toys in the world, are not cheap, but my children can still play with mine 40 years ago ....

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Kaitsu on Thu Apr 22, 2010 2:10 pm

The new keeper will last for 40 years of playing? confused
avatar
Kaitsu
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 138
Join date : 2010-04-21
Location : Helsinki / Finland

View user profile http://www.subu.fi

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Thossa on Thu Apr 22, 2010 2:41 pm

Well, well, well... a non-breakable keeper sounds promising. Exclamation

Will there be a guarantee for 40 years, Piero Wink

And what about the patterns to control the new stuff. Will they given as well to each player?
avatar
Thossa
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 627
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 55
Location : Far beyond

View user profile http://www.dstfb.de

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  masaniello on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:07 pm

Are you sure the price will be 12€?

I think for plastic 4€ or special offer, 3 goalkeepers for 10€.
avatar
masaniello
Future winner
Future winner

Posts : 2
Join date : 2010-04-22
Location : Italien

View user profile http://www.facebook.com/scanotto

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Thossa on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:10 pm

I second that bounce
avatar
Thossa
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 627
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 55
Location : Far beyond

View user profile http://www.dstfb.de

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  manairre on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:40 pm

The price isn't the first problem for me but the matter. The same goalkeepers for all is a good idea. But I have a preference for the metal against the plastic.


Last edited by manairre on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:53 pm; edited 1 time in total
avatar
manairre
Grand Prix Winner
Grand Prix Winner

Posts : 63
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 44
Location : Stembert

View user profile http://www.scstembert.net

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Admin on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:42 pm

Agreed, it miust be as cheap as possible. Also, I wonder how FISTF will control that players in Singapore, Australia or Argentina play with the new keeper...
avatar
Admin
Admin

Posts : 1330
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 42
Location : Somewhere in Belgium

View user profile http://templeuveunited.blogspot.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Thossa on Thu Apr 22, 2010 6:46 pm

Maybe it would helpful if you can say, there is already a test piece of that "new plastic goalkeeper" made and used.

Is there a prototyp already "born"?

Did you already tested it to make sure the doubts written by Marcus are rightless?

If so, can we see a picture of it, please
avatar
Thossa
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 627
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 55
Location : Far beyond

View user profile http://www.dstfb.de

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Guest on Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:47 pm

in 2010 to send a package to Singapore, Australia or Argentina .... not a very complicated thing ..... then will the local federation to distribute, for example, the first tournament.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Admin on Thu Apr 22, 2010 9:13 pm

Anyway the basic idea (discussed in Frankfurt) was to give the first one to every player for free. I hope the new Board will keep his promises!
avatar
Admin
Admin

Posts : 1330
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 42
Location : Somewhere in Belgium

View user profile http://templeuveunited.blogspot.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Rob Smith on Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:09 pm

Admin wrote:Agreed, it miust be as cheap as possible. Also, I wonder how FISTF will control that players in Singapore, Australia or Argentina play with the new keeper...

FISTF are not aware that we play in this part of the world, so it shouldn't be a concern tongue
avatar
Rob Smith
International Open Winner
International Open Winner

Posts : 29
Join date : 2010-04-23
Age : 42
Location : Perth, Western Australia

View user profile http://www.subbuteoaustralia.com.au/index.php

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  EFM on Sat Apr 24, 2010 12:04 am

Thossa wrote:10 - 12 € for the plastic keeper seems to me too much money affraid
Will it be multicolored?

10-12 Euros for a single plastic goalkeeper ? I hope it is just a joke. This is almost the price for a metal based goalkeeper.
avatar
EFM
Challenger winner
Challenger winner

Posts : 9
Join date : 2010-04-22
Location : Lisboa - Amadora - Portugal

View user profile http://tribodopiparote.blogs.sapo.pt/

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Admin on Sat Apr 24, 2010 8:54 am

We all know that with the price of plastic and the investment for the mould, the price of a keeper should not be higher than 3 Euros.
avatar
Admin
Admin

Posts : 1330
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 42
Location : Somewhere in Belgium

View user profile http://templeuveunited.blogspot.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  kechris on Sat Apr 24, 2010 11:37 am

To Pierro Capponi:
Your dream is table soccer to become sport. But the decision for one type keeper is not a sport decision.
I use the last 8 years the SAME plastic toccer keepers with aluminium rod because is light and strong. I have 3 of them they didn't ever broke (PLASTIC IS MORE FLEXIBLE THAN METAL) and i painted them many times. Now they are about 1mm bigger in all dimensions but they are in limits yet.
Many of my friends prefer the keepers with base . If you decide for one type of keeper many people will change keeper. This is a decision which gave disadvantage to many players.
I have a plan to create a new type of keeper. But now i cann't do it because you took these -out of sport- decision. I know the prices for plastical materials. If you prepare more than 1000 pieces the cost is 1e per piece. About 1e for the plastic handle and few cents for 15 cm aluminium rod. I cann't understand why new keeper will cost 12e. Total soccer complex teams in a box with 11 figures in base and a plastic keeper sell 15e. Can you explain me why the new version keeper is so expensive?

You need a new keeper because you believe that is unfair the different styles of keepers. I think that is unfair to select one style keeper for all and to look for profit by selling this keeper.
So i believe that in future you will ask the same type base for all. Maybe the same pitch the same balls the same goalpost the same figures.

I watch football on TV and every team has different clothes and material (shoes gloves etc by adidas puma nike etc). I think that football is sport. Can you explain why you want one type keeper? I think that is better to give limit dimensions and hard ban for the players who use illegal materials.
Which is the REAL problem?
avatar
kechris
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 582
Join date : 2010-04-22
Location : Greece

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  macillo on Sat Apr 24, 2010 12:25 pm

Hi Kechris,

I'm agree with you about he cost to high of the goalkeeper and to do the possibility, from now, that many producer can to produce it in respect of the drawings made by FISTF. I'm not agree with you about your opinion that "the decision are out of sport". All the federation can to take the decision about the materials if they consider that the used materials is out of control. The production of actual goalkeeper is out of control!! How you control all the goalkeeper in the tournament if the referee cannot collaborate with you for to have a regular situation? The only solution is to do a new rule (because until today the rule about the dimension of the goalkeeper is a no-rule for all, first for the federation!) thay impose to use a only one figure. I know that a lot of players will be disapointed, in Italy too, but I hope you are agree with me, to much irregular goalkeeper are used in the tournament.

I hope that the price of 12 euros is just for example, because I think that more than 5/6 euros for one goalkeeper is a "theft" Twisted Evil

Ciao
avatar
macillo
Future winner
Future winner

Posts : 1
Join date : 2010-04-24
Age : 44
Location : Italy

View user profile http://scstradivari.altervista.org

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  kechris on Sat Apr 24, 2010 6:22 pm

Thanks for your answer macillo.

The answer in your question is simple. If every head referee has a thickness gage (price from 5 e) can count the dimensions of keepers.
5.1.1. Maximum height of the goalkeeper: 39 mm
5.1.2. Maximum thickness of the goalkeeper figure: 6 mm
5.1.3. Maximum width of the goalkeeper: 21 mm
and have a three dimensional defending contents of maximum 2700 mm3


The first 3 conditions are simple to check. I think that is easy to check and the last. I know the way.

Do you know that the new bases without disc are out of rules?
4.1.3. The maximum height of the playing figure including its base shall be 3.9 cm, the minimum height shall be 2.7 cm.
Because these bases with subbuteo figures or 2k4 (corda) are lower than 27 mm. But many good players use these bases. Only with 3d soccer figures and the heavy weight figures are legal for the new bases!!! Who care?
So we must select one type of bases for all players?
avatar
kechris
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 582
Join date : 2010-04-22
Location : Greece

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Kaitsu on Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:37 pm

Might be a stupid question, but is there dimension for the rod?
avatar
Kaitsu
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 138
Join date : 2010-04-21
Location : Helsinki / Finland

View user profile http://www.subu.fi

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  von K. on Sat Apr 24, 2010 11:06 pm

1. Why is a FISTF homologated goalkeeper, which was bought this year, suddenly illegal according to FISTF? If FISTF say something is legal, it can't say a month later that it isn't. Whoever is on the BoD doesn't matter. They are all serving the same federation, and if the federation thinks something is legal, it can't say it's illegal the next day. As unprofessional from the federation as it can get.

2. If the problem is size, then why can't a player choose metal or plastic. The weight of the keeper is very different, so players are not equal in the change.

3. If the new keeper is done, the mould should be given to all manufacturers so that they can compete with the price.

4. Talking about the size being like a monster is ridiculous when the idea has been to take distance from football (mistake in my opinion if we want more players) in other rules, too.

5. Very important! What on earth is the problem with these keepers now? I don't see too many 0-0 scores even between the best players (for example Bertelli 4-1 Verhagen with "monster" goalies). So there is no problem at all (see number six below). If games end in tennis scores it takes away the excitement and anticipation of a goal. And bigger keepers also bring more upsets in the results, which makes a sport interesting and harder to predict. It's no wonder football is so big, because scoring is difficult and you always have the possibility of an upset.

6. And last but not least: Why is it that players like me, who doesn't even bent the rod, who respect the rules, have to buy a new keeper. Why don't the players, who don't respect the rules, get punished severely. It would be professional. This is just stupid. As Kechris wrote, it isn't so difficult to measure, and if a player brakes the rules, he is banned from tournaments some time.

7. Why waste all that federation money on this, when there are about million better ways to use it (for example to cover the costs of federation presidents attending a congress). I maybe have missed something, but I didn't know this is a filthy rich federation.


Last edited by von K. on Mon Apr 26, 2010 12:15 am; edited 2 times in total

von K.
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 854
Join date : 2010-04-21
Location : Finland

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Thossa on Sat Apr 24, 2010 11:53 pm

At the moment I think we have world wide about 60 % of players using the so called Toccer keepers. Unfortunely different versions of this typs are circulating.

The biggest offend is the position of the arms. Some are like Jesus at the cross, some are correct.
An other offend is the rod, the thinkness and bending of it and the thickness of the keeper´s figure thanks to paintwork.

All this problems could be easily solved by a simple tool which already is used several times: a refeere tool to control the distances for free-kick and corner. Just add a indentation to control the thickness of the rod somewhere and in the middle of the referee tool a mask for the keeper´s figure.

All we need is somebody who produce thousands of such referee tools, rather than to spend thousands of new plastic keepers for free.
avatar
Thossa
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 627
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 55
Location : Far beyond

View user profile http://www.dstfb.de

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Guest on Sun Apr 25, 2010 6:03 am

Von K
1. You are wrong. For the good of the game something can change anytime so long as it is an improvement
5. You are very right about the scores. My opinion exactly
6. I second that. Cheaters and not legal players should be punished. It is a matter of fairness.

Thossa
Iam not sure how you control the maximum volume of the keeper. This is the only flaw in your thought

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  kechris on Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:52 am

Kaitsu wrote:Might be a stupid question, but is there dimension for the rod?

5.2.1. The goalkeeper's rod shall be a straight rod up to 15 cm in length
and 4 mm of maximum width, excluding the handle.
5.2.2. The handle may not exceed 10 cm in length.

The solutions (like Thossa's proposal for tools) are simple.
The decisions (to ban the players with unfair keepers) are difficult.

If FISTF find "balls" and ban the real unfair persons then we can dream better days. But FISTF looking for euros no for "balls".

Goodmorning.

p.s I can produce a tool with three dimensions with one euro per piece for 1000pieces.


Last edited by kechris on Sun Apr 25, 2010 12:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
avatar
kechris
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 582
Join date : 2010-04-22
Location : Greece

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  georgy on Sun Apr 25, 2010 9:35 am

Kaitsu wrote:Might be a stupid question, but is there dimension for the rod?

5.2. Dimensions of the goalkeeper-rod

The rod is fixed to the goalkeeper figure or the base and is part of the
goalkeeper by fulfilling the following standards:
5.2.1. The goalkeeper's rod shall be a straight rod up to 15 cm in length
and 4 mm of maximum width, excluding the handle.
5.2.2. The handle may not exceed 10 cm in length.

By the way, can you bend or not the rod once? A top greek player did this in front of me when
helping/teaching another one so I also copied it. (I do not know if it helped :-) But when you see the
experienced ones doing it you assume that it is correct.

I do not think that there is somewhere in the rules a limitation about the weight.

According to the rules every player who is affecting in any way his base is illegal since it is not homologated! It is as if you buy new shoes and shape them to your preferences! And I think this is the magic (except the game itself) of our hobby. You try different combinations of bases plus figures plus polishes to see which is best for your style, fingers, technique.

On the other hand it is frustrating to see monster goalkeepers with "fat" rods. So the idea of ONE goalkeeper for all is correct, BUT all of us who spend money in the last year or less to buy a new USELESS goalkeeper are not going to be very happy!
avatar
georgy
International Open Winner
International Open Winner

Posts : 42
Join date : 2010-04-23
Age : 46

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Thossa on Sun Apr 25, 2010 11:17 am

LLcoolJ wrote:Von K
Thossa
Iam not sure how you control the maximum volume of the keeper. This is the only flaw in your thought

Well okay, I think I know what you mean. The dimension of the keeper looking from the side, right?
That´s certainly true, but the solution can be another mask on the same tool including the dent to contol the rod.
avatar
Thossa
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 627
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 55
Location : Far beyond

View user profile http://www.dstfb.de

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Thossa on Sun Apr 25, 2010 12:02 pm



This could be a simplke solution. A piece of plastic about 2 mm thick and enough space for a sponsor.

Think it over.
avatar
Thossa
Major winner
Major winner

Posts : 627
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 55
Location : Far beyond

View user profile http://www.dstfb.de

Back to top Go down

Re: New plastic goalkeeper

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 3 1, 2, 3  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum